B: An ALE friend has suggested to me that the feminist movement has improved since the days of 2012 to 2018.
The feminist movement has become less toxic, less dogmatic, less ambivalent and opposed to men's equal rights and men's welfare, less ignorant of science and economics, less patronising of women. It now values due process, individual justice and freedom more...
I have not seen much evidence either way on this but I am open to this possibility. What are your thoughts? Is this true?
Feel free to post articles or evidence.
A: I like how '- feminists are caring more about men = feminism is improving.
Me: you think feminism shouldn't care about men?
A: spell out the word dude.
Is socialism about the owners of capital?
Is environmentalism about oil companies?
Like. Why do people ask these patently weird question sh
Me: nowadays it's fashionable for feminists to claim that they and feminism care about men
A: not nowadays. That was the unfortunate PR strategy adopted by some misguided bloggers.
The message was hey! It benefits you TOO. As in - you’ll get something out of it too.
I’m sorry, I’m not an airhead graduate from a gender studies department
B: "feminists shouldn't care about men". Well, Linda, at least you are describing the situation as it is. No one can accuse a feminist who says that of dishonesty.
A: I said feminism caring about men isn’t a sign of improvement but I guess the three math degrees didn’t make you very good at grammar
C: Correct
BUt fEmInIsM iS abOuT eQuAliTy
A: yeah. It is. For women.
C: Hilarious
A: equality is measured / assessed with reference to something. Are you stupid?
C: "It's about equality. For women"
If feminism is about equality *for women* does it make women better or worse at logic?
A: oh the half baked twit talking about logic...
Let me try and put this in terms you understand.
Equality for women - meaning a society where women are not disadvantaged simply because of their sex.
but PLEASE continue ranting.
C: Men are disadvantaged because of their sex too, women are not the only ones (feminism is narcissistic)
A: nope. They’re not. Any ‘disadvantage’ they claim is self inflicted. With two sexes, both can’t simultaneously disadvantage the other. They’re disadvantaged because of gender but... YAWNNNN
I should tell you incel, by your standards I’m a veteran feminist. And you’re boring. Run away
C: A "veteran feminist" lmfao
Inb4 incel oh damn beat me to it
A: oh he thinks he’s smart. And it’s not the other sex eh. I‘m so not impressed by your idiocy.
Go crawl back to your incels. Bye.
C: This is why feminism breeds misandry, because it assumes all the problems women face are because of men, and that women cause no problems for men.
D: Gender equality doesn't include half the genders
Socialism doesn't talk about who owns the capital
Environmentalism doesn't talk about oil companies
Can't wait to find out what's next...will it be cooking recipes without food?
A: wow the strength of that analogy blows me awayb
D: you're the dumb dumb that thinks feminism can't or shouldn't talk about men. You're literally the problem society has with feminism 😂
A: can’t spell either or know what an analogy is.
But sure yeah dumb dumb is an amazing response
D: if the shoe fits. Your "analogy" doesn't work if you're straight up incorrect about the entire thing. Like the point of socialism is literally about capital owners and spreading their wealth equally. Environmentalism is about regulating oil companies. Dumb dumb is being polite about the situation...
Weeee equality means only one side gets my compassion for their issues and socialism doesn't need capital owners. Fuckin smoothbrain takes.
Me: Actually you need to distinguish between 2 senses of "about" here
When A says that feminism isn't about men, she means that feminism does not and should not care about men
It doesn't mean that feminism does not analyse men
When you talk about socialism talking about those who own the capital, you mean socialism as an ideology examines who owns the capital. So in that sense socialism is about those who own the capital
At the same time, socialism says that those who own capital are evil. So socialism is not *about* those who own capital in that socialism does not care about those who own capital
But at least we have a proclamation by a "veteran feminist" that feminism shouldn't care about men, and that feminists who claim that it should and does are lying to get men behind it
Elsewhere in the thread:
"I was a feminist two years ago. The fact that I am not now is an improvement? I see how much it hurts men AND women now. But I’m rare and I don’t know any other women in my community that can see the issues with feminism. It’s mostly a lot of disinformation and I think the internet is allowing for information to at least be accessible."
"I dont recall my 42 year old sister EVER trying to use the word "mansplaining" at me prior to 2016 (the funniest part is she has two boys)... it's now expanding far beyond its original clique of retarded gender studies majors. I wasn't seeing unconscious bias seminars being promoted at work until very recently, either."
"Way back when I was a tween and teen in the 90s and early 2000s, in my circle, feminist = being a strong independent female, in a confident claim your own happiness eff what anyone else thinks sorta way. Wasn't much talk about men, although there was a vein of seperatism that sometimes seemed a bit much. And some talk about the evils of history and the patriarchy, but in a "we can reject that" way, not in a "I will always be broken and it's all your fault so you owe me and gotta take care of me" way. A lot of rely on yourself, pay your own way, don't expect other people to do stuff for you, get out there and do what you want to do without worrying about what everyone else thinks or says about it.
Now it seems like too many feminists are totally obsessed with what everyone else thinks or says. And want to be taken care of, catered to, constantly soothed, instead of seeking to be strong n independent."
So much for "stereotypes" - one here being of the combative and nasty feminist who sex-shames men